Tropes: Breaking News To Mystery Noir Novelists

[Content Note: Sexist Language, Violence]

I know it was very disappointing that we had to drag ourselves out of the 40's where it was appropriate for a hardboiled detective to call random women "doll face" and "candy tits" and "sugar ass" and (for all I know, because this really isn't my usual genre) "caramel hips", and I understand that a few of you are very disappointed with this change and would like to bring it back into vogue. I get that.

And I do understand that those of you who are disappointed about this change have realized that women vote with their wallets and that most women found this kind of language to be contemptible and unworthy of their time and attention. But here's the thing. Here's what I'm trying to say. Reintroducing that kind of language and the sexist attitude behind it but then 'fixing' it by having women beat up the man every time? That does not actually make it better. 

Feminism Pro-tip: Feminists are not actually all about beating men up.

Writing Pro-tip: Protagonists who are assholes are still assholes even if they are beaten up for it.

16 comments:

Ana Mardoll said...

And how do you keep getting contracts for this stuff? It's like you saw "Sin City" and thought it wasn't over-the-top parody.*

* If "Sin City" isn't meant as over-the-top parody, I don't want to be right.

Yamikuronue said...

The only thing I know about Sin City is that it apparently broke Frank Miller's brain, since everything he wrote after it was "all darkness and whores, all the time".

Ana Mardoll said...

The movie is a guilty pleasure for me, but I cannot understand why.

[tw: bullying]

Well, no, that's not true. I like the stylized black-and-white-but-with-the-occassional-splash-of-color thing. And it was a scary movie that I was able to watch by myself at a time in my life where a person kept calling me a coward and weak for not being able to watch scary movies. So that was kind of my talisman of "see, I can watch hardcore stuff" that let me assure myself that other person was being a bully and not accurately representing me.

But I definitely see it as over-the-top parody (when I watch it at all, which is pretty much once every three years, if that). And if I'm wrong about that, I don't want to be right. LALALALALALALALA!

Makabit said...

Sin City...oh, that was the over-the-top parody noir thing my husband thought was really fun. (He likes the graphic-novel-made-movie genre better than I do.

I barely remember it. Gritty and dull.

Ana Mardoll said...

It also had Frodo in it! But, yes, that's the one.

Does your husband also go in for crappy video game movies? I can't NOT love those. Resident Evil Movie Marathon!

Makabit said...

I don't think I've ever seen one, but he may like them...he's all part of that gamer geek world.

Ana Mardoll said...

They're awful, but in such a wonderful way. Some of my favorite movies. *ducks head*

Cupcakedoll said...

...hang on, are her hips caramel-colored or caramel-shaped? And how can he see the color through her clothes? Or is she wearing one of those fantasy loincloth sides-less skirts? "The dame walked into my office, I saw immediately that she's just escaped... escaped from a Boris Vallejo illustration. So I said, "Hiya, caramel hips..."

Ana Mardoll said...

escaped from a Boris Vallejo illustration.

*dies laughing*

Timothy (TRiG) said...

I really want to know what caramel hips are, now.

*Sticks Boris Vallejo into Google image search* Oooh. Right.

TRiG.

hapax said...

So just for grins, I googled Boris Vallejo + caramel, and I came up with his painting Elijah on Mount Carmel which is so awesome in its sheer over the top WTFery that I am consumed with acquisitive covetousness.

gyroninja said...

I know it was very disappointing that we had to drag ourselves out of the 40's where it was appropriate for a hardboiled detective to call random women "doll face" and "candy tits" and "sugar ass" and (for all I know, because this really isn't my usual genre) "caramel hips", and I understand that a few of you are very disappointed with this change and would like to bring it back into vogue. I get that.

But it's still okay to call them "nervous broads" and "hysterical dames", right?

.... Please?

Majromax said...

and (for all I know, because this really isn't my usual genre) "caramel hips",
I first read that as "camel hips." I still didn't know quite what that was supposed to mean, but it seemed more sensible.

Darth Ember said...

Hee.

Note: Noir tropes within.
----
I crossed my legs and leaned back. This dame... she was something special. For starters, the outfit she was almost wearing had somehow not got her arrested for public indecency.

Maybe it had something to do with the enormous longsword in her hand. Ladies and their swords. A beautiful combination.

Said sword was resting on my desk, its point scratching the wood. It was safe to say this lady had my full attention.

"You're the investigator?" she asked - and if you called that voice a purr cats'd give up purring forever, unable to compete.

"That's me. Fireball Frank. How can I help you?"

"I'm in a little bit of trouble." She pouted regretfully, but there was something playful to it, like trouble was all to be expected, and even a little fun.

"What kind of trouble?" I asked, tearing my gaze from eyelashes so long you could stage a marching band of pixies across them.

"Temple trouble."

Whoa whoa whoa. Back up there. I didn't get involved with godly stuff - that lot were always a bit quick at hurling the divine lightning, if you know what I mean, and while I liked my boots, I didn't want them and some wisps of smoke to be all that was left of me. "I'm not so sure I can do anything there..."

"You're the only one I can trust," she whispered.

And... that's about a complete summary of how I wound up tied to an altar, watching dark cultists wave disturbing symbols in the air. It misses a few of the intervening steps, but this is my life. It was always going to go like this.

---

Sorry, those few sentences sent my brain into full action mode, haha.

Fluffy_goddess said...

Is Sara Paretsky needed as an antidote?

Loquat said...

I seem to recall a line from the movie version of "A Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Forum" in which the slave-dealing neighbor described a particular slave courtesan as having "the pelvis of a camel" as part of his sales pitch. I'm not sure what exactly that's supposed to mean either, but the woman in question followed the sales pitch with some belly dancing, so....

Actually, I still have no clue.

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