Content Note: Insularity, Medical Issues, Blood-Drinking, Meat-Eating Twilight Recap: Edward and Bella have concluded their dinner conversation and are heading back to Bella's house.
Twilight, Chapter 9: Theory
It was pointed out waaaaaaaaaay back in the distant past of last year that one of the appealing aspects of Twilight is the fact that when you are dating a Super Secret Vampire Boy, you have a secret. And I think that's a very good point, actually.
I don't keep secrets very well. No one in my family does; we actually just give each other shopping lists for Christmas and birthdays, a tradition that baffles my husband to no end. "Why don't you just give cash?" he asks, mystified at our un-romantic shopping list exchange.
"Because we like opening presents," I explain. "It's fun."
"But you already know what's inside them!" he points out.
"Well, of course! We don't like surprises." And the look on his face, and the look on my face... well, you'd just have to be there to see it. It's just such a different paradigm.
All of which is a long way to say that I don't like secrets. Whenever I get a secret, I immediately go divulge it to the cats so that I'm not the only one who knows anymore. And then I feel better, because I know they won't tell anyone. (And even if they did, no one even tries to listen to them.) But I do understand the concept and appeal of a group secret.
When you have a vampire boyfriend, you have a group secret. You can't share the secret with the world at large, but you can share that secret with your vampire boyfriend, or with his vampire sister, or with your werewolf buddy. What before had the potential to isolate you from everyone now has the ability to bring you closer with a small, intimate group of friends, lovers, and family.
I also think this could be potentially very powerful in a teenage setting, particularly for teenage girls. The common media portrayal of many teenage girl groups is the sharing of All The Things, usually huddled around a flashlight during a slumber party or clumped together at the school cafeteria table. In a time when many young people are trying to figure out what they want to be when they "grow up", what kind of body they're going to be living in for the next few decades, and what sexual orientation they rolled in the great game of Life, it seems natural to me that some people might walk a tentative line of Wanting To Share and Wanting Not To Share.
With vampirism, the choice is easy and already made for you: You can't share.
None of this, I want to stress, is automatically unhealthy or bad. Indeed, I almost think the intimacy of a relationship could be vaguely defined by some kind of information sharing metric -- Husband knows more about me in the areas of X, Best Friend knows most about me in the areas of Y, Mother knows most about me in the areas of Z. Father is for Monty Python, Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy, and all the other fun British humor things. (Obviously this is going to widely vary for everyone. I'm rambling here. It's what I do.)
But! I had a point in all this and my point is this. While it is not bad to have and share intimate secrets with people in a relationship, there's a point at which in-knowledge can become an excuse for an unhealthy level of insularity. And I feel like Bella -- by becoming so utterly absorbed into Edward at the cost of all other relationships and her own personal health -- dances close to that line.
Certainly, in my opinion, Bella's patented spice-blend of mental snark, disdain, and disgust for the people in her lives isn't improved by her sudden "in-group" linkage to a man whose middle name might well be Disdain.
I was worried suddenly, worried about protecting Jacob.
"He just thought it was a silly superstition," I said quickly. "He didn't expect me to think anything of it." It didn't seem like enough; I had to confess. "It was my fault, I forced him to tell me." [...]
He startled me by laughing. I glared up at him. He was laughing, but his eyes were fierce, staring ahead. "Tricked him how?" he asked.
"I tried to flirt -- it worked better than I thought it would." Disbelief colored my tone as I remembered.
"I'd like to have seen that." He chuckled darkly. "And you accused me of dazzling people -- poor Jacob Black."
Bella is worried about protecting Jacob Black. She should be: she just divulged his name, his family, his location, and his dangerous willingness to talk about the Cullens to a vampire who has a history of taking matters into his own deadly hands and who is willing to do just about anything to protect his family. She should be very worried about Jacob, even if this is a "better late than never" situation.
But she's trying to protect him in ways that still leave all the cards in Edward's hands. She's submissively trying to turn Edward back to her, to put herself in harm's way on Jacob's behalf. That's kind of noble -- I mean, Jacob wouldn't be in trouble at all if Bella hadn't betrayed his trust at literally the first opening to do so -- but it's a continued victimization of Jacob. Really helping Jacob would mean being honest with him about the danger he's in so he can choose how to respond.
This exchange where Bella "helps" Jacob by playing up his innocence and her seductive ways is really just an elaborate way of mocking him. Bella is mocking Jacob to Edward, persuading him that Jacob is too little and young and innocent and ignorant to be concerned about. Of course, this doesn't matter one whit if the threat Jacob represents is one of discovery: if Jacob doesn't believe the treaty to be true, he may be more likely to spread the word about the Cullens and provoke the Volturi. But the real subtext here is that Jacob isn't a romantic threat to Edward, and Edward acknowledges that he is not by laughing at poor, bedazzled Jacob and his hilariously broken heart.
And this is kind of the "unhealthy in-group mentality" I was mentally poking at earlier.
"What did you do then?" he asked after a minute.
"I did some research on the Internet."
"And did that convince you?" His voice sounded barely interested. But his hands were clamped hard onto the steering wheel. [...]
"I decided it didn't matter," I whispered. "It didn't matter?" His tone made me look up -- I had finally broken through his carefully composed mask. His face was incredulous, with just a hint of the anger I'd feared.
"No," I said softly. "It doesn't matter to me what you are."
A hard, mocking edge entered his voice. "You don't care if I'm a monster? If I'm not human?"
"No."
He was silent, staring straight ahead again. His face was bleak and cold.
"You're angry," I sighed. "I shouldn't have said anything."
And then there's this.
I get what Bella is saying here: it doesn't matter to her feelings if Edward is a vampire. It's kind of like Intent Isn't Magic, except instead of being about how the intent behind existence of problematic elements in speech and text doesn't prevent us from being hurt when we see them, instead it's about how Edward's underlying nature doesn't prevent Bella from being awestruckedly in love with him whenever she sees him. I get that.
But the wording irks me here because, in my opinion, it should matter what Edward is.
Whatever the answer -- Superman, Spiderman, Vampire, Werewolf, Warlock, Wizard, Demon, Angel, Whitelighter -- Bella may still choose to be with him because love. She may not mind the difficulties of a their relationship, or she may decide that she wishes to be whatever he is herself. (Assuming that's possible.) She may have no trouble whatsoever adjusting to this new situation. But it should matter, if not what Edward is, then at least how what he is influences what he can do and how he can live. (Or un-live.) It should matter to Bella these things, not because they'll necessarily prevent her from loving him, but because those things will affect whether or not they can have a relationship, and what her life will look like within that relationship.
This doesn't always translate well to real life situations, but for an example: Husband very probably has Asperger syndrome, and I very definitely have scoliosis and Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. This essentially means that for very large portions of the time, Husband is withdrawn and uncommunicative and I am tired and achy and snarly. None of this has prevented us from being deeply in love and choosing to build a life together, but it has influenced how we relate to each other. Husband understands, for example, that he can't quit his job on a lark to realize a dream of building computers from gently-used Beanie Babies because I am frequently incapacitated without warning and therefore it falls on him to be the steady wage-earner. In contrast, I understand that when I need someone to chat to in order to take my mind off of chronic pain, I lean on my parents or my friends or my blog on the internet rather than place that "entertain me, now!" burden on Husband.
And all these realizations about how our bodies affect our relationship? That took a long time to learn and sort out and understand. And it doesn't always work for everyone, especially once you start throwing vampires into the mix. (One of the things I liked about the one "True Blood" / "Sookie Stackhouse" book I read was that the author seemed to understand and sort of gently hint at the edges of the fact that a Vampire Boyfriend can be heck on your sleeping schedule and social life.) So while I get the "it doesn't matter, I'll still love you" sentiment, I still feel like "but it does matter, because it might affect whether or not we can be together" should follow. And it doesn't.
But then I never have liked "All You Need Is Love", so maybe that's just me.
He was suddenly resigned. "What are you curious about?"
"How old are you?"
"Seventeen," he answered promptly.
"And how long have you been seventeen?"
His lips twitched as he stared at the road. "A while," he admitted at last. [...] "You haven't asked me the most important question yet." His voice was hard now, and when he looked at me again his eyes were cold.
I blinked, still dazed. "Which one is that?"
"You aren't concerned about my diet?" he asked sarcastically.
"Oh," I murmured, "that."
"Yes, that." His voice was bleak. "Don't you want to know if I drink blood?"
Like most Edward Cullen lines, I hate the delivery (EDWARD CULLEN, YOUR TONE OF VOICE SUCKS), but for once -- just this once, perhaps -- he has a point.
And this is one reason why "I don't care if you're a vampire!" doesn't translate so well to human relationships, because this isn't like pretty much all the other things. Many humans eat meat, but most of them don't eat the meat of other humans, nor do many of them eat meat while it's still alive.
Again, this isn't to mean that right off the bat Bella shouldn't be with Edward. But it does mean that I find her stubborn incuriousness to be personally distressing. "I don't know and I don't care -- I love you," is sweet and understandable and, yes, I have been guilty of saying (and meaning) just that, but it's not healthy. (And, no, I'm not demanding that Twilight be healthy, I'm just talking out loud here.) Jacob has told Bella that the Cullens don't hunt humans -- which is good -- but the ethical and moral dilemmas don't end there.
For instance, later we will learn that the Cullens stand by and let the Volturi kill people on their watch because they aren't powerful enough to oppose them. Alright, it is what it is, but that's the sort of thing that -- going into a relationship -- I would need to know about.
I flinched. "Well, Jacob said something about that." [...] "He said you weren't supposed to be dangerous. But the Quileutes still didn't want you on their land, just in case." [...]
"The Quileutes have a long memory," he whispered.
THEY ARE NATIVE AMERICANS SO WE WILL SPEAK OF THEM IN STILTED DIALOGUE AND REFER TO THEM AS A SINGLE HIVE-MIND.
"We try," he explained slowly. "We're usually very good at what we do. Sometimes we make mistakes. Me, for example, allowing myself to be alone with you." "This is a mistake?" I heard the sadness in my voice, but I didn't know if he could as well.
"A very dangerous one," he murmured. [...]
"Tell me more," I asked desperately, not caring what he said, just so I could hear his voice again.
He looked at me quickly, startled by the change in my tone. "What more do you want to know?"
"Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people," I suggested, my voice still tinged with desperation. I realized my eyes were wet, and I fought against the grief that was trying to overpower me.
I have a confession to make.
The first time I read Twilight, this was when I started screaming incoherently at the book.
"Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people"??? REALLY. Gee, Bella, why the heck do you eat animals instead of people, hmm? Well, did you even think that maybe -- just maybe -- he might have the exact same reasons?? And for being all "it doesn't matter what you are, love conquers all, hold me" five minutes ago, apparently you really do believe that biology equals destiny and that it's somehow weird, unnatural, or heroic of Edward to make a choice to not murder people.
Deep breaths. I realize now that this probably isn't the spirit intended in the text. Bella is crying and afraid that Edward is going to go back to shunning her and she thinks that her feelings will matter for nothing in this decision and she feels helpless. She's trying to draw him out, to keep him talking, to prevent him from descending into a brood and making up his mind on something that neither of them really wants at this stage. I get that. I do.
But gods help me, it's a really poor wording, that question.
Because if you strip that subtext away, if you pull away the theory that Bella doesn't mean it like that, she's just trying to keep him talking, if that is gone, then Bella is a terrible person. She's a person who is so accepting of the whole vampire biological drive concept that she thinks it's exceptional to not want to eat people. Because this isn't a "how" question, as in "tell me how this works"; it's a "why" question, and I would think -- I would hope -- that the "why" would be blatantly obvious.
A vampire is a human who woke up one night and wasn't human any more. Depending on the mythos, they may not have any physical or mental changes besides the desire and/or need for a liquid diet of blood. There's no reason to assume that an ex-human will suddenly cast aside all the considerations for life and bodily autonomy and choice and consent and not-being-a-cannibal to suddenly not even want to not prey on humans. Not be able to, that's one thing, that's a "how" question; not want to, that's a "why", a motivation.
"I don't want to be a monster." His voice was very low.
Edward doesn't want to eat humans for the same reason that Bella (presumably) doesn't want to eat humans. And if Bella doesn't understand that, I'm not sure she should be a vampire.
32 comments:
It's hard to tell what kind of vampires there are in the Twilight universe, but the question that is in essence "I thought vampires had no choice but to eat human blood, how can you go without/use animals?" is a reasonable one to wonder about, though maybe asking a vampire who has been aggressive to you while you are isolated is a bad idea. Still, her question seemed not-crazy, in the context of the books, and I don't think "why are you able to do this" is that offensive, especially assuming that Bella is probably not in a terribly sensible state of mind and is likely having trouble wording things correctly.
I do think that Bella is legitimately not catching on to the fact that predating humans is inherently wrong---and I think there are some "boys will be boys" roots to that particular error---but I also think that there's a space of possible answers to her "why" question that a more targeted "how" wouldn't necessarily reveal.
Like:
**
> "Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people," I suggested, my
> voice still tinged with desperation. I realized my eyes were wet,
> and I fought against the grief that was trying to overpower me.
"You'd want to hunt them too if you knew what they were thinking about. All the time."
". . . what, like . . ."
He didn't give me a chance to finish. "Nothing but Monty Python quips. Constant, unrelenting, Monty Python quips. All. The. Time."
**
> "Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people," I suggested, my
> voice still tinged with desperation. I realized my eyes were wet,
> and I fought against the grief that was trying to overpower me.
"It's a curse," he explained, bluntly. "Until the last of the Cullens finds and turns their perfect vampiric mate, we're forced to grovel in the dirt and drink the filthy blood of beasts."
**
> "Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people," I suggested, my
> voice still tinged with desperation. I realized my eyes were wet,
> and I fought against the grief that was trying to overpower me.
"Oh, they aren't animals before the hunt begins," Edward explained.
Of course! That vampire site on the Internet had mentioned that sometimes vampires turn people into animals before hunting them.
**
Dang, now I have half a legend in my head about the first werewolves being a pair of lovers who turned the tables on the vampire who'd transformed them, but I can't work it in.
**
> "Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people," I suggested, my
> voice still tinged with desperation. I realized my eyes were wet,
> and I fought against the grief that was trying to overpower me.
"I'm allergic," Edward admitted. He gave an embarrassed laugh.
**
> "Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people," I suggested, my
> voice still tinged with desperation. I realized my eyes were wet,
> and I fought against the grief that was trying to overpower me.
"Eating humans is ecologically unsustainable," Edward said scornfully. "This is the twenty-first century, Bella."
**
> "Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people," I suggested, my
> voice still tinged with desperation. I realized my eyes were wet,
> and I fought against the grief that was trying to overpower me.
"It keeps me hungry," he said, and he looked away.
I don't think it's weird to give your family a list for birthdays and Christmas. I started doing that when I was around 10-ish; my parents were divorced, so each one got a list tailored specifically to reduce duplicate presents, and included what I thought I was more likely to get from that parent. THEN I started just asking for one "big" present (usually something I would have to save up more than a couple months for; now I just ask for appliances) and figure if my parents want to get me a couple little things like stocking stuffers, that they know me well enough to pick out something I'll like or at least use once or twice.
Bella's question about why Edward doesn't eat people almost works if you take into account the fact that she's not privy to all the ins and outs of vampirism; she doesn't know if vampires start out with no qualms about killing humans, or if centuries of feeding on humans desensitizes them to what they're doing and makes it seem normal. So I don't think it's too out of line for her to be wondering this. If that's the case, however, then what she should be asking is "HOW are you able to eat animals instead of people?", not "WHY do you eat animals instead of people?" I'd say it's pretty clear why. (Although now I'm wondering if Edward's "You're my brand of heroin" comment could be taken as more than a horrible metaphor - that maybe human blood acts as a drug when ingested by vampires. Thoughts?)
I'd think that hunting humans would be the environmentally responsible thing to do, considering our population growth and the environmental destruction we wreak.
I could see a crying character saying "Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people" and meaning "I want to hear you say you do it because Murdering People is Wrong out loud, because that will mean you aren't a complete monster and maybe love will be enough and we can be okay." But to pull that off you'd probably need the character in question to say that out loud when the vampire's understandable reaction is "... wut?" and probably also more evidence in the buildup that the human character is horrified because they suspect they're falling for someone that is likely a supernatural serial killer.
with just a hint of the anger I'd feared.
Maybe she feared it because she wants him to be happy and cheery and not-Edward-like, but this stood out to me as something that sort of breaks the whole, "I feel safe around you thing." He's been going on about how if she doesn't keep him calm he'll start killing people, and now we've got Bella specifically saying she's afraid of his anger, and she knows from experience that he has no respect for her body and will just grab onto her and drag her to his car against her will if he feels like it.
So that sort of jumped out at me. Call it a salient feature for me.
-
Edward: You haven't asked me the most important question yet.
*pause*
Bella: While that is a complete sentence its function is almost on the level of an introductory clause, and yet you've followed it with nothing. In other words: get to the point.
Edward: Aren't you concerned about my diet?
Bella: You could starve for all I care. But, "about your diet," isn't a question I could really ask, so I'm thinking that's not "the most important question".
Edward: Don't you want to know if I drink blood?
Bella: You think that's the most important question?
Edward: Yes.
Bella: Seriously?
Edward: How is it not the most important question?
Bella: Isn't it more important to ask whether you kill for your meals? Do you get it from the source or from a blood bank? What flavor of blood do you drink? Have you ever had octopus blood? I've heard it's green. Where is your blood drawn from? Does it come from willing or unwilling hosts? Is the manner of sucking closer to that of a bat or a mosquito? What effects are visited upon the hosts when you lap directly from the source? Have you ever killed anyone?
*pause*
Bella: Don't these all seem to be more important questions? Hell, I drink blood. What does that tell you about me? Nothing. As it so happens I only drink my own blood and then only when I've been wounded, and then only as a byproduct of tending wounds in the lack of proper first aid or when I'm simply trying not to make a mess. Which should go to show you that how and why one goes about drinking blood is more important than the fact that one drinks it.
Edward: I hate you.
Bella: *shrugs* Well, I hate you. (Somewhat cheerful:) Glad we're on the same page.
Whenever someone espouses this opinion For Realz the first thing I say to them is something on the order of "then, would you and your family agree to go to the head of the line, since you understand?"
"
I flinched. "Well, Jacob said something about that." [...] "He said you weren't supposed to be dangerous. But the Quileutes still didn't want you on their land, just in case." [...]
"The Quileutes have a long memory," he whispered.
THEY ARE NATIVE AMERICANS SO WE WILL SPEAK OF THEM IN STILTED DIALOGUE AND REFER TO THEM AS A SINGLE HIVE-MIND.
"
I know you're right here, especially in the larger context of the work and its, ah, treatment of Teh Injuns, but still, this bit made me go, "Oh, come on, Ana!" Any group would probably reach the 'vampire bad' conclusion here.
-
Also, I took the 'why not brutally murder people?' thing at face value given that it's coming from Sociopathy 101 Example From A Gods-Damned Textbook, Bella. I'm sure she meant 'how can you do this/how does it work?' but I really wouldn't put it past her to just say, well, you know, Vampires are special enough, and certainly humans, even the ones assigned 'friend' or 'family' or 'emotion' values, aren't People, not like she and the Cullens and even the Vampire Popes. Hence, they don't matter.
I've read your comment five times and I'm not sure if you think I actually think this. If you don't, carry on, I'm being silly. If you do, I do not actually think that humans should be hunted or culled. My comment was for funsies.
> "Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people," I suggested, my
> voice still tinged with desperation. I realized my eyes were wet,
> and I fought against the grief that was trying to overpower me.
"Because... because I can't bear listening to what people are thinking when they're about to die." He stared down at the steering wheel.
I suppressed my natural instinct to scream, "Keep your eyes on the road!" If he was that confident in his abilities, he probably had some reason... I hoped. Instead, I said, "Good - you do still have a conscience."
He twisted his mouth into that curious expression which would've meant anger in a human; I wasn't sure what it meant with him. "I'm not sure I do."
At least he was looking back at the road now - or, at least, toward it. "You just said you'd rather not make people feel bad. That's a conscience. And that means... oh, most of the stories back to Stoker are wrong; vampires do have consciences!"
"Because... because I can't bear listening to what people are thinking when they're about to die." He stared down at the steering wheel.
Oh, good God. Bella, get away. Run away now. He can't hear your thoughts. His only reason for not killing people doesn't apply to you.
Hmm, Bella's question is worded poorly, but as others have noted not completely ridiculous. What with the 27 million different vampire mythoses (mythi?), it is quite possible that there are just vampires who aren't able to do otherwise. Though if Bella thought that was possible, she really should have reconsidered the "It doesn't matter what you are" sentiment.
It actually reminds me of Ana's Claymore deconstructions. When I saw it, I never assumed the Ascended Beings, even the leaders that seemed calm and inteligent, had any choice in their drive to kill humans to eat. In that story, we never really saw any that made that choice. Claymores-just-turned-Youma could sometimes suppress it, or could hold on for a short time begging for others to kill them before they turned completely. But I never thought that they had any choice after the first 5 minutes or so. Ana meanwhile argued that since they were inteligent, they must have been able to make such a choice, they simply chose to continue to kill. I still don't know which is correct. The anime IIRC never explained it, and we have no real-world analogue to sapient creatures who have an instinctive, inborn drive to kill and eat humans*, so I have no idea what the creators of the show were trying to say.
*There may be the odd human with a specific mental disorder that causes him to obsess over canibalism, but it's not a drive the entire species has.
"Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people," I suggested, my voice still tinged with desperation. I realized my eyes were wet, and I fought against the grief that was trying to overpower me.
Coming right after "tell me more," this line really felt like desperation is the true descriptor to me. Bella's already decided that she doesn't care about Edward being a vampire, possibly because even though she evidently knows he's dangerous, she doesn't believe he's dangerous To Her. (Isn't there an old joke about all teenagers being sociopaths for at least three hours of the day?) We've seen her minimize her social interactions, and we've speculated that she shows a lot of signs that she may be depressed. To me, this conversation sounds like her slowly going:
"I know I don't care about most people, and I feel guilty about that, but I don't; I am crazy in love with this guy, and even realizing he isn't my species doesn't sway that, so I'm going to daydream about being with him and take any chances to be with him that I can because when I'm with him I'm pissed off and angsty and awkward but I don't feel like I'm going to accidentally kill myself walking across a room because with him I feel *safe*. I want this. I hate my life, and I'd be pretty ok with giving all this stuff I hate up to be with someone who makes me feel safe and loved. And I thought we were going in that direction -- we're halfway there for god's sake! -- but apparently, He Is So Consumed With His Angst That He's Going To Let Me Down Too. I'm not letting go that easily. I am keeping him talking, damnit, because so long as he's talking to me, I've still got a chance."
So to me, her question feels like a time-buying strategy. She needs a few minutes to gather herself and launch her next assault on Edward The Relationship CockBlock, and 'why' questions tend to solicit longer answers. It's a relevant question -- if he replies that he likes the chase, that people are too dangerous to hunt, that it's like preferring chinese over italian food, even that he only hunts humans when he's working for the military and can turn his hunger to patriotic advantage but that his handlers insist he takes a few years off now and again so he doesn't become unmanageable -- then she's learned something that could be very useful to know. Because his stated reason is to avoid being a monster, she's learned a lot about his relationship with morality and where he draws his own distinctions, information she may be able to use later on. But the poing of asking isn't that she cares: it's enough for her that he *doesn't* hunt people. The details are just there to be used as ammunition in the relationship later on.
I tried to word my comment so it wasn't assuming you thought that or coming out guns blazing, because I tend to get a little 'smash straight ahead in straight line' sometimes; so I guess it was a stunning success. No, I was just saying in general, not lashing out at you or anything.
"Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people."
"Well, gee, Bella... I wonder why anyone would ever consider not murdering for their daily meal." As soon as he said it Edward realized that making a poetry reference was probably pointless. If she understood poetry she'd probably be able to understand the value of human life. He decided a different approach, "Why don't you eat people?"
In the pause that followed Edward came to the disturbing realization that she was thinking over the question and not coming up with an answer.
"Forget I asked that." Edward nearly shouted. He took a moment to compose himself and continued, more calmly but his voice still quick and agitated. "Seriously. Forget it, never ponder the question again. Do not eat people. Eating people is wrong.
"Stick to plants and dead animals, steer clear of soylent green." Edward looked at the ceiling, no answers there. He put his head in his hands, no answers there. "I'd rather not be a murderer and I certainly hope you feel the same way." He looked into Bella's eyes and got no sign of comprehension. No sense of familiarity with the idea he had put forward. If it could have, his blood would have run cold.
Damn, this post and Ana's above is the first time I've come to actually sympathizing with Edward.
Its uncomfortable. Please stop.
If she understood poetry she'd probably be able to understand the value of human life.
This is suddenly making me wonder how much of her backstory Bella made up. And why? Her father would doubtlessly hear the real story from her mother; she doesn't care about most of the other people in Forks (unless she's making that up too) - obviously, she's telling all these lies to try to make Edward appreciate her more! (The darker possibility is that she's doing it to try to placate him by making herself sound more focused on him... but he can read her mind by the end of the series, can't he?) Of course, the truth fades through in some places - like her failed allusions to Romeo and Juliet, or when she has to admit she did all her vampire research on the internet, or even when she calls herself bad at lying while repeating dozens of needless lies.
Next question: I'm sure Edward sees through this, since he has to have read all these things ten million times. So, why's he going along with it all? Why's he hanging out with a known blatant liar? Maybe he's a secret scientist and wants to figure out where her mental shield comes from. Maybe he's decided to waste a decade or so humoring this poor girl. Or... maybe Alice has seen visions of Bella's self-centeredness making her a deadly villain down the road, and the whole family is swinging into high gear to derail that any way they can! Yes, that has to be it! :D
Later, when Edward tells Bella that he spent a while feeding on humans, her immediate reaction is "That's understandable"--before he gets to the part where he used his mind reading to ensure he only killed evil humans.
However, in New Moon, when she briefly thinks Jacob and the other werewolves are killing random people, she decides that she can't overlook it, that she needs to confront Jacob.
Whatever else may change, we may rely on this constant: Bella is a hypocrite
Or... maybe Alice has seen visions of Bella's self-centeredness making her a deadly villain down the road, and the whole family is swinging into high gear to derail that any way they can!
For that matter, why can't this be all of their pasts? Or at least some of them? Now I'm thinking of them as this prescient squad of super-guards, who get told things like "this baby will grow up to be an evil overlord" and so go and work their way into the baby's life, steering them into 'better' life choices and eventually training them to turn their skills to 'good' instead of evil. And then they absorb the formerly-potential-evil people with a big melodramatic speech including "all that evil that you stopped? All the bad things you've kept from happening? That was all Nothing compared to what you might have done if you'd wanted to. This is why you have an obligation to use your powers for good: because the alternative is to use them for evil. You can try to choose a middle ground, but in the end, you will do one or the other. Now what are you going to do?"
Nature vs. Nurture: Can We Stop Evil People From Being Evil And Do We Have The Right To Make That Judgement? Now With Sparklepires!
This is "Have you tried not being a monster?" - question turned upside down:
"How do you managed to stop being a monster?" . OTOH, while the wording is poor, the question is still very relevant.
So I guess they're in love now? Seems we skipped the "Falling in" part. And yet it's still better than Romeo and Juliet, where they look at each other for the first time and immediately start trading overblown declarations of eternal love.
I think the "I don't like hearing what people think when they're dieing" or "I don't want to be a monster" reasons still show an essential selfishness to the Cullens.
> "Tell me why you hunt animals instead of people," I suggested, my
> voice still tinged with desperation. I realized my eyes were wet,
> and I fought against the grief that was trying to overpower me.
In that moment, Edward looked to me with a look of pure grief. "I'm sorry," he said. "That you would have to ask why... it's like I've met Jack the Ripper before he started... there's only one thing I can do..."
>I think the "I don't like hearing what people think when they're dieing" or "I don't want to be a monster" reasons still show an essential selfishness to the Cullens.
Maybe, but I think it's also somewhat realistic. (Yes, realism in this book! Wow!) The question is so basic and fundamental that I think most people would be taken aback and stammer out something like, "Because I don't want to do something so horrible!" If I were asked that question, I wouldn't be surprised if I answered the same way - not because it's my real reason, but because it's something immediately apparent that everyone can understand.
Not to inject see reality into your speculation, Isabella, but is there any actual proof past Edward Cullen's word that he and his family don't hunt humans? With the power and influence Carlisle has, he could easily make sure any suspicious homicides became accidents. Not to mention how close Edward supposedly was to attacking the Port Angeles attack crew. I don't think that Bella should be asking the why question yet, as we haven't established whether or not the how is true.
I really wouldn't put it past her to just say, well, you know, Vampires are special enough, and certainly humans, even the ones assigned 'friend' or 'family' or 'emotion' values, aren't People, not like she and the Cullens and even the Vampire Popes. Hence, they don't matter.
That's how I read it. I think Bella meant precisely what she said.
Bella hates people. (Except the Cullens and Jacob.) She seriously, SERIOUSLY hates people. She thinks violent thoughts about people for trivial things. She hates having to interact with them. The only thing she hates as much as someone being unfriendly to her is someone being friendly to her. She doesn't like the way people look, she thinks their pasttimes are worse than pointless, and she thinks all people are deeply stupid. She might believe killing people is wrong because that's what she's been taught, but she doesn't know it deep down like most people do, because she has no ability to empathize. And did I mention how much she hates people?
I think that's one of the things that disappoints me most about Twilight (there are so many to choose from!).
If you know your Vampire Tropes, Carlisle-as-Doctor telegraphs a great deal of interesting material. Maybe he's bringing home Capri Sun bags of blood and fiddling the surgical records (like, ordering 8 bags when he really only needed 3). Maybe he's signing off on bogus autopsies and saying people died from "snakebite" when they were really Emmett being unable to control himself. Maybe a LOT of things.
But then, no, it's just because he loves people and he has SELF-CONTROL. *sigh* I respect Meyer's right to world-build however she pleases, but it's such a let-down for me.
There's a reason that the Darkest Sketch interpretation doesn't need a whole lot of tweaking to be a good story. All the right elements are there, but the author refuses to let things go in that direction. Even if we don't use our Vampire Trope Tome, we can still build ourselves a properly scary story. We can even let it end in a romantic way between the Martin character and the vampire, either with her as a vampire or without. But the least we can do is provide a good narrative and some say elements to keep the reader interested.
Eating humans would be ecologically sustainable if humans (at least in the US, where they live) didn't use up more resources in production than cows....
I could also read the original dialogue as Bella feeling a gap growing between them, wanting to pull Edward back, and asking something that would bring him back to the common ground of Not Murdering People so that he could see that really, yes, they could make it work! This requires Bella assuming that it IS safe common ground, but she seems pretty unquestioning, so I could see that.
I suppose it depends on the sort of ecology we're talking about. The natural environment could certainly stand to lose a few people, but the self-contained system of my former workplace would rapidly go to shit if the right two or three people were to vanish. Everyone's a cogwheel somewhere...
If we're talking about a global scale here it would seem that humans a woefully under-grazed and some super predators preying on us would do wonders for the ecosystem. Just imagine what the oceans would be like if the human population were brought to a more manageable level. The fish population would explode back to it's previous levels and certain currently near extinction species would prosper.
Which makes one wonder if vampires could be a sort of keystone species (like the Yellowstone wolves) reintroduce them and the ecosystem comes to life.
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